Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2009 6:55 pm Post subject: What is wrong about Bible Students
As I already expressed about my recent discovery of Bible Students, it turned out to be a big disappointment.
First of all, my Bible class elder was short tempered. I could not believe it. He is elderly guy who suppoed have good character leading the Bible class, instead, he was quick to be agitated. I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he may change in time but he became even worse as time went so I stopped attending the class. He was angry at many of the things I did. I asked him many questions and told him I can wait for the answer until the next time. I asked if he minded me asking him questions and he told me no. Since he is retired guy and don't have job, so I thouht he would be happy getting the questions from me. But I was wrong, he hated getting the questions. In addition, he was repeating himself over and over that I was not getting much out of his Bible class. When I nudged him to go to next, he told me he is not done yet, angrily.
I did not want to waste my time with him any longer.
Last edited by joyful on Fri Mar 06, 2009 6:48 am; edited 1 time in total
Second of all, they discourage people to be baptized. They interogated me with tons of questions insinuating that I am not fit to be or ready for baptism. In other words, they judged me. They are takaing the place of Jesus. Baptism is expressin to the the public that I accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior.
Jesus tells His disples to "Make disciples of all nations, Baptized them in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit. And theach them of obety everything I have commanded you". They are refusing to do what Jesus commands them.
They seem not to want people to be baptized. What kind of Christians are they???
Joined: 20 Feb 2009 Posts: 4 Location: Springfield, Missouri
Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 10:44 pm Post subject: Bible Students and Baptism
Joyful, you quoted "They seem not to want people to be baptized. What kind of Christians are they???" That comment tells me that you have not heard what those brothers and sisters were trying to explain their viewpoint . Brother Mark was trying to get you to see that the consecrated are baptized. It is not correct in saying "They seem not to want people to be baptized..." it seems to me, sister, you are obsessed with proving organized religion is wrong. Please feel free to correct me if I am not right in my assumption. Several others who were BIBLE students on the forum stated the fact that Bible Students were not an organization.
Brother Clair McManigal _________________ Truth never changes unless a lie is sprinkle into it then the Truth becomes a lie!
Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:16 pm Post subject: Re: Bible Students and Baptism
Clair McManigal wrote:
Joyful, you quoted "They seem not to want people to be baptized. What kind of Christians are they???" That comment tells me that you have not heard what those brothers and sisters were trying to explain their viewpoint .
Yes, I heard it plenty. I understood what they are saying about consecration. I understood that consecration means if I gave my life to Jesus. I told them over and over that I have been serving Jesus and I also gave my life to Jesus when I became believer 10 years ago. You seem to be one of those elite Christian that only few understand what it takes to follow Jesus. It is arrogant the way you think, brother.
Quote:
Brother Mark was trying to get you to see that the consecrated are baptized. It is not correct in saying "They seem not to want people to be baptized..."
Like I told you I know what it means to be consecrated. They ignored my comments over and over.
Quote:
it seems to me, sister, you are obsessed with proving organized religion is wrong.
Obsessed? If you call it obsessed, then so be it.
Quote:
Please feel free to correct me if I am not right in my assumption. Several others who were BIBLE students on the forum stated the fact that Bible Students were not an organization.
Brother Clair McManigal
If talk like duck, and walk like duck, you are duck, brother. What you are doing is pretentious.
I pray that you get rid of your elite mentality because it is not of Jesus.
Jesus wants all His followers to be committed to Him. Jesus says (Mat 24:13) "But he who stands firm to the end will be saved" we have to be faithful to the end. He also tells us "if we don't give up everything we have, we cannot be His disciple" (Luke 14:33). Jesus also tells us to "love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, strength and mind and love your neighbor as yourself" (Luke 10:27). We cannot be obedient to these commandments unless we are committed to Jesus.
BS are telling each other it is ok not to be consecrated. They are disrespecting what Jesus commands His followers.
One consecrated elderly's husband stayed home watching football game while she was at Bible class even though he is one of BS. She also told me that her children are not consecrated. The Bible tells us to "train a child in the way he should go" (Proverbs 22:6) and she is telling her family they don't have to be consecrated.
These are BS' fruit. Jesus says we know by our fruit if we are of God or not (Matthew 7:15-17). According to the Scripture, they are not of God with this kind of fruit.
Bro. Jeff, what is happening to you..? Have you forgotten? Sit down and open your green volumes from 1 to 6 - remember Job's answer in my previous post? (chapter 42) -- can you not meditate with God's Word..? Pastor Russell did.
This is one of consecrated BS's post. Notice that instead of quoting Jesus, she refers to Russell.
i apologise for my own (mis)conduct with regard to my iterations, but i simply wish to see a milder, more gentle and humble mindset from those i wish to learn from..
jacob
Well said, Jacob, I do not wish to learn from any Christian leaders who are lacking in humility and kindness. Humility and kindness are MUST for Christian leaders. When they don't have this quality, their reasoning of Scriptures will go along accordingly. God will not help us to understand Scriptures if we are lacking in humility and kindness.
They are continually making up excuses one after another. that's what happens to people who are puffed up. They don't have humility to admit when they are wrong with their puffed up attitude.
Thought I might add to what has been said that I posted on another forum. The idea being that we live in a world dominated by a spirit that pervades our thoughts and actions and affects all the world. Bible Students included. - Jeff
Picked up an interesting book last night entitled, "The New Wine Generation." I found one part very interesting as we tend to look at religions and their faults without realizing the big picture that affects all towards error.
"Let us begin this chapter by mentioning that the spirit of Greece is the number one enemy of the supernatural. It's influence in the Church of Christ has paralyzed the prophetic gifts and anything having to do with the supernatural."
"In 100 AD, after the death of the apostles, the spirit of Greece began to infiltrate the church. The Greek world in which the first apostles ministered was full of various philosophies. The Greek society loved wisdom, and for this reason it sought after knowledge to such an extent that it devoloped an idolatrous mind. In other words, it loved knowledge."
"The Greek culture was the breeding ground for many philosophers, including Aristotle and Plato. The had great debates trying to prove their points of view; they loved to debate and to reason. In the midst of all of this cultural influence, the church was born. It was only by grace and the apostolic anointing that the church was given the ability to conquer this mentality. The spirit of Greece works as a rigid structure, it is impregnated with human reasoning and philosophy; its only objective is for man to become a super man or a god."
"The spirit manifests itself in the form of a thought that keeps the believer from entering the kingdom of God or any of its supernatural dimensions....The spirits of intellectualism and rationalism became an impediment to many people of the day, rendering them unable to believe that Jesus had risen from the dead. Universities at that time were full of these spirits. The spirit of pride, debates and an idolatrous mind also govern many of our educational systems today."
"Athena, Sophia and Diana are Greek goddesses that largely sustain this philosophy in the Greek culture....Those who followed this philosophy were philosophers,spcializing in rhetoric and arumentative dialect. They were teachers, philosophers and professionals who elaborated complicated arguments. Sophism is a deceit derived from the devil himself. 'While the Jews looked for signs, the Greeks sought after wisdom.' 1Cor 1:22"
"The Greek culture flooded the western world, the United States and Europe. The plan of this spirit is to govern the world."
Chracteristics of the Greek Culture.......
1> Humanism - This philosphy began with Heraclito; he dethroned God from the center of attention and replaced him with man, making himself a god. An example of this can be seen in the new age movement; it teaches that man is god; therefore, he has no need to rely on a supreme beinhg for his existence.
2> Intellectualism. In this train of thought, the most important accomplishments are obtaining titles, human recognition and fortune above all things, including God. According to this Greek thought, reasoning guides the universe and its goal is to develop man intellectually, leading him to become a god in his own right. This philosophy is the predominant in eastern cultures such as Russia and Europe....Intellectualism consists in denying everything that cannot be explained; it abolishes and takes for granted the concept of living by faith because it cannot be explained through scientific methods. Denial is one of the reasons the church has lost it's power; it's faith is based on sight. The word of God Says we should live by faith and not by sight."
3> Denying the existence of demons, therefore denying the need for a ministry of deliverance for believers. Unfortunately, we find many believers bound by the enemy because their pastors do not believe in deliverance or the existence of demons. One of the devil's biggest lies is the conception that demons do not exist and the church has chosen to believe."
4> Resists the supernatural - This is a vital point I want to get across to you. One of the reasons why many ministers and believers do not move inthe supernatural is due to the influence of the spirit of Greece. People of the Bible(the Jews) were trained to believe in extraordinary and supernatural things. Our God, Lord of all, is a mighty and supernatural God able to do great miracles, healings, signs and wonders, cast out demons and inspire phophecy. His very essence is supernatural. We his people, must move in this dimension, but the influence of the spirit of Greece is so great, it has created strongholds in our minds, preventing us from receiving our salvatioin, healing and deliverance. We choose to reason everything and if we do not understand, we simply do not believe it."
5> Does not accept the gifts of the Holy Spirit - It is rare to see believers operating under the gifts of the Holy Spirit; we may talk about them, but do not believe the gifts. The spirit of Greece says the Word of God is like the word of any ordinary man, but the Hebrew mentality says that he is supernatural God. This is the mentality that Jesus presented to the people. Howwever, he did not just talk about it, He also demonstrated the supernatural."
6> Love of Beauty and esthetics - Intellectualism has an exaggerated interest in beauty.; it worships beauty more than God through sculptures, architecture and more. It exalts the physical body to the point of making it an object of passion. This can be seen today in diets, sports, anorexia, bulimia and plastic surgery."
7> Love of sports - The Olymppic Games originated in Greece. The spirit of behind the Olympics is the spirit of competition. It challenges everyone to be the best at any price. This attitude has crawled into the church. We want the best without regard to who we step on, deceive, betray, or how many standards need to be compromized. "
8> The spirit of Greece gave birth to theater, masquerades and performances, thetoric hermeneutics and homiletics. With all of the ideologies of the spirit of Greece, the Church became divided.
9> Democracy, pharmacia, and porn - "Let us analyze 'porneia' refering to all sexual abuse. The Greek continiually sacrificed to their god Porno, sexual abominations with animals, orgies, and prostitution, etc. Unfortunately, this Porno spirit has infiltrated the church; many are now serving in ministry are bound to adultery, fornication, masturbation, etc. Farmakeia means pharmacy. The spirit of Greece encourages dependence upon pharmaceuticals and drugs. It works by administering a drug that might cure an illness, while at the same timme causing secondary effects, or harm in other areas. The spirit of greece makes a person co-dependant on drugs, or pills andkeeps them bound for prolonged periods of time. What is the solution? Divine health is not merely divine healing; it is exactly what it says."
" Democracy originated in Greece. It substitutes for theocracy. Church members vote pastors out of ministry; this is the way church councils work today. If these councils are in agreement with the people's choice, then they accept their vote to hire or fire a pastor or leader. However, when God calls a man, he reveals his vision, calling and plan for him."
10> Love of fame - This involves doing things that impress man and not God. It seeks faame, position and "show" for spectacle. These have penetrated the church today. You do things to call attention to yourself and you dislilke serving behind the scenes because what you really want is a position where everybody can see you."
11> The entertainment media - Many churches seek human methods to keep people in; otherwise it loses its memebers. Church has become a social club instead of a "House of Worship," or a place to seek his presence. Young people cannot find a place to receive the Word; instead theytrain in sports, or anything else as a means of entertainment, and neglect the teaching of the Word, or the supernatural.
12> New things captivate people - "Many of you have an 'itch' to hear the truth, but in reality, you have no desire to change or repent of your sins. You continue to live with your bad habits and bound by your different lifestyles. You must receive the Word that is preached; otherwise it is pointless to teach new things if you don't practice what you hear."
13> Narcissism -"This is idolatry to self. Narciso fell in love with himself; he would look at his reflection in a pond and flatter himself on how beautiful he was. Many of us are the same way; we live for ourselves and not for God; we love our sin." _________________ reslight.net/forum - bibletoday.com- Divineplan.org - mostholyfaith.com -
13> Narcissism -"This is idolatry to self. Narciso fell in love with himself; he would look at his reflection in a pond and flatter himself on how beautiful he was. Many of us are the same way; we live for ourselves and not for God; we love our sin."
This thread is about BS's fatal flaws I observed, and above is one of the characteristics main BS' practice.
Can I ask you a personal question? Why so much negativity against the Bible Students? So you had a bad experience with them, why continue fueling the fire with your anti-Bible Students rants? Shouldn't you be better than that? Why have you lowered yourself to their standards by belittling them.
As I browse the threads on your forum, the most active ones have been negative either towards the Bible Students in general or attacking RR and others.
Can I ask you a personal question? Why so much negativity against the Bible Students? So you had a bad experience with them, why continue fueling the fire with your anti-Bible Students rants? Shouldn't you be better than that? Why have you lowered yourself to their standards by belittling them.
As I browse the threads on your forum, the most active ones have been negative either towards the Bible Students in general or attacking RR and others.
Just let it go.
M
I expect a lot from Christian leaders. There are so many fake Christian communities out there. The Bible tells us to expose the evil deeds of darkness. I am only doing what the Bible tells me to do. There are so many covering up for wicked practice of so called "Christians". I will not cooperate covering up for them. If you don't like it, you don't have to read. I will keep on exposing all evil deeds who are using God and Jesus name.
I don't know how much you have read this forum. I was excited about finding about BS, I thought they didn't exist. I got many harassing comments because I advocated this organization.
I hope you don't cooperate with evil practices of Christian communities. You are only pleasing satan, not Jesus.
I'm sorry, but it seems that you are using your disappointment and anger with the Bible Students as a front to attack and expose them. In essence you become no better than they are.
I'm sorry, but it seems that you are using your disappointment and anger with the Bible Students as a front to attack and expose them. In essence you become no better than they are.
I am Jesus' servant and I will expose all evil deeds. Those BS people who are using God and Jesus name and being stumbling block to people trusting them.
You must be one of those mainstream BS. Shame on you attacking me without knowing what I am exposing.
I have searched around all kinds of denominations and churches, including JW. They were all disappointment. I have been exposing all evil deeds about them. I will do the same about BS too. They are no different from any other organization I joined and served. JW and BS are not extorting money from their members but they are operating with arrogant attitude.
So all denominations are wrong and only Hitomi has the Truth? Then why not share the Truth found in Scriptures, and let the Truth expose error? All I or anyone who visits here will see, are rantings and raving from a woman who hasn't quoted ONE scriptural verse to support her criticisms against the Bible Students\ or any other denomnination.
So all denominations are wrong and only Hitomi has the Truth? Then why not share the Truth found in Scriptures, and let the Truth expose error? All I or anyone who visits here will see, are rantings and raving from a woman who hasn't quoted ONE scriptural verse to support her criticisms against the Bible Students\ or any other denomnination.
You sound like you came from RR's forum. Just because all organizations I experienced are wicked, I am the only one who is right???
I have been many trinitarian forums too. I had some who did not like me say the same thing over and demand I quote everything I say. You don't see any quotes in my forum???
I don't see you quoting in your ranting here.
I don't throw pearls to pigs. You came here to cover up evil deeds.
I have been out spoken about my faith and have many enemies. I even have stalkers. You and mitspeh are like one of those stalkers. It seems that your pride is making you stoop so low, friends. Your coming here just to rant is nothing but stalking behavior.
Speaking of Joyful ... who seems to bhelieve she will sit on the Lord's right hand, go to her forum and see all the loving Christlike threads she has started on the Bible Students. Her hatred for us has consumed her to the point where she cuts and paste threads from here and answers them on her forum. She's actually talking to herself.
RR, I am only exposing your true color. There are too many so called christian organizations covering up their evil deeds. I am using this forum to show how far puffed up fake believers go to save their face.
I have many readers here. I am not talking to myself. This is a public forum.
I am only exposing your forum how low you will go. I have been to many fake Christian communities. I know their tricks to humiliate their opposer. You conveniently forget that Scripture says to expose evil deeds which most organizations do their best to cover them up.
RR, do you remember I exposed evil deeds of JW at your forum and you did not have any problem about it?
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